Interview with Sima Urale

Interview with Sima Urale, August 2008

I applied and was accepted into the Swinburne Film & Television School (now known as VCA) in Melbourne. I have a theatre background and was acting in professional theatre when I felt that I needed to be involved in a more accessible medium to create and make stories that mattered to me, and that's when I thought of film school. Once I got in, I soon realised that it was very similar to how theatre productions are done, so it felt like a very natural progression for me.

IF YOU WERE TO TEACH FILMMAKING…

I would first ask what stories people want to tell, what messages and what issues they want to convey. Basically, what moves them to want to make films in the first place. I am not a film buff and although a film school graduate myself, I always hated being made to watch films because I think it's a personal experience when and why I choose to watch a film. But if I had to screen any films, it would be films and filmmakers that have broken convention; Orson Welles' Citizen Kane, for his innovativeness and vision in breaking out of narrative convention, also his technical brilliance and foresight for introducing new lenses to cinema. Kurosawa films for his beautiful cinematography and composition, and for being my main inspiration in giving me confidence that films in our own indigenous language can translate universally. I would also show Once Were Warriors as a great example of a powerful movie, not for its cinematography or anything else, but for its boldness and honesty, a truly powerful movie that affected audiences world wide and really did make a difference to people's lives. Children who saw it asked their mothers to leave their abusive fathers. To me, that's what makes it a powerful film.

FIRST LESSONS

The first short film went perfectly as planned, but when it came to my second short film, I was rather bowled over when things didn't go to plan. I needed to accept the fact that no matter how planned or organised you are, some things just don't go your way. Since then, I have learnt to relax, also never take things for granted and to communicate everything loud and clear. I've also learnt that team dynamics make a big difference to the outcome of a project and that this industry is all about relationships. It's not about who you know, but how well you can take care of your team and how well the team or producers can take care of me.

WHAT'S THE BIGGEST MISTAKE A NEW DIRECTOR SHOULD TRY TO AVOID?

Not to be afraid of making decisions. Everyone will blame you for the end result anyway, so you may as well take that responsibility onboard right from the start. But when you do make a mistake, and like a good leader or chief should - be strong and admit to your mistakes and ask for help. Get counseling!

DO YOU MAKE THE FILM FOR YOURSELF OR WITH THE AUDIENCE IN MIND?

First and foremost, I make films for myself and what moves me, as I find that most people will relate to those very same issues anyway, even in the most remote countries. If I made it for someone else or for the sake of an audience, I may as well direct commercials, which now and again I do. 

However, in my own films, it's more important that I try and stay true to myself as much as possible, and very often people are as affected by those issues as much as me.  For me, filmmaking is like any art form, a way to express our thoughts and ideas in the same way a painter chooses his subject matter. In saying that though, at a certain point it's also important to take into account how audiences overseas might view it as well.

WORKING WITH THE WRITER

I have to say after directing a short film and then the feature Apron Strings, films that are written by other writers, there is definitely a huge difference when I write and direct my own. Writing is extremely hard for me, so I can appreciate what these writers have achieved. With directing someone else's, I am always aware that it's their 'baby', something that took them years to think on and write, so what they think matters to me a lot. In contrast, when I direct my own material, I have dreamt and thought about it so much that I am much more sure of myself in every aspect of the film.

Although a lot of fun, the difficulty with directing someone else's script is often trying to grapple and understand their perspective and intentions, down to every single scene and every bit of dialogue. Sometimes their intentions aren't as clear as they think, and it's my job to work on making those clearer, sometimes asking the writers to please re-write and clarify. Because if I don't understand it, then how can the audience? It often works the other way around too, and some things are overstated, so often I will ask if we can drop exposition or unnecessary scenes that don't add to story.

RULES ARE MADE TO BE BROKEN

I think there is a grammar in filmmaking, and yes there are many conventional rules, which drives me batty - especially when people get too stuck on them like a scratched record! It's great to know the basic rules, but I believe that rules are made to be broken, and some simply should be broken to keep us all awake from getting too used to TV soap. However, it's great to have the rules to fall back onto when I cannot think of anything imaginative to do - that's when I know I am getting really boring. Films are like books, I mean who wants to read the same style of writing from book to book?

ON WORKING WITH AND CASTING ACTORS

I like to choose the actor after seeing them audition, because some people may be amazing and charismatic in person, but stick them in front of a camera and they freeze like a popsicle. Then there are those that may bore me to death and even look dull, and yet when you stick them in front of the camera, they suddenly light up and surprise you with a huge screen presence. So I like to test them all in front of a camera, just to make sure that they don't fall apart on 'action'.

I am a graduate of Toi Whakaari (NZ Drama School), and acted in professional theatre for two years before going to film school, so I have seen and felt all the insecurities and struggles that actors experience, and each and every one of them is different. Recognising, what type of personality and actor they are, really helps me to read them and decide on what way to approach them. Some don't like being over directed and prefer to be left alone to mull things over, some love the attention from directors, and many are just simply nervous or too eager to please the director.

So often I have to change tack from person to person. The key, for me, is being malleable and changeable for their sakes, so that they can feel comfortable and confident in front of the camera.

Some actors only get worse as you shoot more takes, this is the case for most non-actors and children, they simply get bored and glaze over. So I watch them closely for that glazed look when I know I've lost them for good, so I tend not to overshoot them. But then there are actors that I know can give me more and will keep at them till they drop. Not because I want to prove a point, but because I know they have it in them to give me more, so it all depends on what types of personalities I am dealing with.

ON SET

I usually prefer to rehearse the actors on set, before setting camera, just to get a flow of the scene and let all the crew see the scene in its entirety. Also to be fair on the poor actors who have probably never had the chance yet to move around in the new set. Then we block through as we discuss what angles we're going to shoot, this not only prepares the crew, but also the actors as to what shots to mentally prepare for. So for me, the actors are the first to get the freedom to move, but then I will often explain a particular movement or blocking that I like and the reasons why, especially if I want something more stylistic.

I do think a lot on my shots beforehand, what kind of emotion and tension I want from a scene, which character is really driving the scene, whose perspective should it be from etc, but at times I need to think fast on my feet and then rely a lot on intuition as well. Seriously though, I have to say that 95 percent of the shots are intentional and are usually well thought out well in advance, which I guess makes me more of an intellectual type of decision maker, but then again a lot of it is based on intuitive ideas that are inspired through the story and subject I happen to be working on.

ON WORKING WITH THE DIRECTOR OF PHOTOGRAPHY

I am very expressive with the Director of Photography (DP), I will use any gesture, any number of words to express my intentions. From experience, I can never take communication for granted and will do anything to ensure that everyone understands me - could be the control freak in me, but it ensures that everyone is on the same page.

My most preferred DP is a wonderful man Rewa Harre, who has the patience and peaceful nature of the Dalai Lama, also an awesome humour which helps us get along a great deal. Rewa also has so much experience with me, that he knows that I have most likely dreamt and had nightmares about the entire project for 3 to 6 months before he even comes on board, so he respects much of my ideas and creative decisions, but also knows that he can disagree with me too. In many ways, we chat and discuss like siblings would, which is great because we can talk honestly without taking each others comments personally. Rewa has done so much beautiful work for me, that although I may have many of the ideas, he is the one who brings it about and creates for me.

ARTISTIC vs ECONOMIC DECISIONS

For me it's very hard to separate the artistic and economic reasons, as they impact on one another a great deal, and taking these different levels of decision making into account, usually equals COMPROMISE. We've all heard it and said it a thousand times like it's some dirty word, but sadly, it's a word we can't run away from, no matter how big a budget or crew. From experience, I can only hope that I know what to let go of and what to hold onto. For me and the sake of any producer I work with, I do try my best to consider the economics when making artistic decisions. Because if I didn't, this could have major implications for the project later on, like ensuring that there is enough budget to cover me in post production, and most of all, ensure the completion of a project.

It also matters to me whether crew are getting paid a decent fee relative to the overall budget, because it's important to me to look after every aspect, including people. It also saves my producer and production a big headache if I can take the budget into account rather than being unrealistic and getting carried away with the fairies.

ON EDITING

Personally, I hate surprises. Film is so manipulative and we spend so much time in pre-production preparing to shoot - basically preparing for the worst and how we can trouble shoot those problem areas from script right through shot listing. So to be surprised at what we have obtained is not ideal for me.

I like to think that editing is a confirmation of what has been shot, but more than often it is potentially a new phase to the storytelling, so letting go of what has gone before, I often discover new and better ways to improve the story and structure. I like to keep myself open to the possibilities that the story can be strengthened and improved through playing in the edit.

WHAT FILMMAKERS DO YOU ADMIRE?

There are too many to mention, but mostly those that have something powerful and moving to say. Documentary makers always amaze me with their stamina and determination to see projects through, particularly those that make their projects over many years with no money. I would've given up long ago! But I will say documentary makers John Pilger, Mereta Mita, to name a few.

As far as NZ, I would have to say Mereta Mita for documentaries which are historical, political, and educational. It's stuff like that, that will probably continue being influential for many years to come.

ON TELLING "NEW ZEALAND STORIES"

Anything told or filmed in New Zealand must be a New Zealand story, even if the cast were aliens. I think it's too limiting and dangerous to confine creative people. We don't tell novelists what to write about, and we don't tell artists what to paint on canvas, so the same should apply to the screen. Some stories are simply too good to overlook, and anyway, what if a kiwi wrote a film set on Mars and it was better than all the scripts set in rural NZ? Yes, it's a valuable sentiment to hold onto that 'kiwiness', but at the same time we are so global and too many things about us are changing.